Buyer's Guide - Entry Level, January 2005
by Jarred Walton on January 9, 2005 12:05 AM EST- Posted in
- Guides
Memory
Selecting RAM for a budget computer is always difficult. On the one hand, dual-channel memory will help out performance on most of the platforms that we've listed (the exception being the socket 754 system). On the other hand, we hate to recommend 256 MB DIMMs as they are rather on the small side, and two 512 MB DIMMs is too expensive. For the Athlon 64 configuration, a single 512 MB DIMM is an easy choice. The other platforms - particularly the socket A Sempron system - are not so clear cut. If you get two 256 MB DIMMs on socket A and later want to upgrade to 1 GB, you will have to add in a single 512 MB DIMM and end up running in single-channel mode. The Intel platforms both have four DIMM sockets and so, even with 256 MB DIMMs, they can reach 1 GB. For the time being, 512 MB is enough for most tasks, but if you just want a basic system that you can upgrade further in a few months, we would recommend buying a single 512 MB DIMM now and adding a second later rather than starting with two 256 MB modules. Keep that in mind as you look at our memory recommendations because pricing concerns pretty much force us to use 256 MB DIMMs if we want dual-channel support.Something else worth pointing out is that all of the budget systems that we listed before use DDR memory. If you really want a socket 775 Intel configuration, you could also get DDR2 memory support. That might even increase the performance of the integrated graphics, but it will also add quite a bit to the cost. If you're looking at DDR2-533 memory - and there's no point in getting DDR2 any slower than that - the price for non-generic DIMMs is around $60 for 256 MB modules and $110 for 512 MB modules. That's almost twice as much as the value-oriented DDR memory that we're choosing!
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RAM Dual-Channel Recommendation: 2x256 MB Corsair Value Select CL3
Price: $68 shipped
For the dual-channel configuration, we have selected Corsair's 256 MB Value Select RAM. The best price that we could find for this RAM was at Newegg, but you can find similarly priced Samsung, Micron, and Infineon RAM at other locations. Corsair is one of the "reliable" RAM manufacturers, and even though the CAS Latency is rated at 3.0, there's a reasonable chance that tweakers could extract more performance from the RAM. The difference in speed between CL3 and CL2.5 RAM is not particularly large, and for a budget system, you would never notice it. Depending on where you live and/or shop, you might be able to find some other brands of memory for a better price. Crucial, Mushkin, GEIL, and Kingston along with the previously mentioned brands are all safe. You could go with other manufacturers like PNY, PDP or Kingmax without too much concern, and even generic RAM will usually work without problems. For peace of mind, however, we prefer to stick with the better known brands. $20 saved is not worth hours of potential headaches in our opinion.
If you really want to cut costs initially, buying one 256 MB DIMM is certainly an option. Windows XP will still run okay with 256 MB of RAM, and adding a second DIMM at a future date is a relatively simple and painless upgrade. Multitasking will begin to take a pretty noticeable performance hit when you drop down to 256 MB of RAM, but if you usually only run one application at a time, it can get the job done. We don't recommend this option to most people, but it's still there should you want it.
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RAM Single-Channel Recommendation: 1x512 MB Mushkin CL2.5
Price: $70 shipped
For the single-channel option (socket 754), we recommend getting one larger DIMM instead of two smaller DIMMs. While it ends up costing $2 more, note that we now get CL2.5 latency instead of CL3 RAM. The performance difference really isn't that great, but CL2.5 256 MB modules would have cost another $10 while here, it's basically "free". The same brand recommendations apply, and if you're willing to risk generic memory, you could get it for as little as $45 to $50. Again, we prefer to spend a little more and have some guarantee of reliability.
While it's not really a budget option, you could also get two of these 512 MB DIMMs and run with a full gigabyte of memory. It's definitely more of a luxury than a requirement for typical computing use, but at the same time, you rarely have to worry about running out of memory even in heavy multitasking scenarios. (Graphics artists, of course, can always use more memory, so the previous statement isn't directed at them.) As we mentioned before, starting with a single 512 MB DIMM and adding a second module in a few months is a good plan if money is tight right now, but you know you'll want more than 512 MB of memory down the road.
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justly - Monday, January 10, 2005 - link
Jarred, Thanks for the responce, and I can certainly understand why you would dislike writing a budget guide.If what you say is true "In a single review with high-end components (which is how we generally handle reviews), a lot of motherboards work very well. When you start dropping down to cheaper RAM, however, it's amazing how frequently system instabilities seem to end up being caused by the motherboard choice." then maybe what is really bothering me is not so much your review but the way motherboard reviews are conducted.
One other thing (just thinking out loud here), how does VIA and SiS chipset affect memory compatibility on a A64 system when the memory controller is part of the CPU??? Do the motherboard manufactures pay more attention to the memory trace lines on Nforce based motherboards (even budget ones) than SiS or VIA based boards??? ... I really think I need an answer to these before I can fully believe you, no offence but I will remain skeptical about your comment to not use VIA or SiS (at least on a A64) untill these are answered.
Maybe you could make a recommendation on how motherboard reviews are conducted, that way Anandtech readers can be informed about these problems that are hidden from us by reviews that only use high-end components.
Thanks again for the reply.
JarredWalton - Monday, January 10, 2005 - link
Good point, PrinceGaz. Of course, my take is that the ability to run the "full" Aero Glass experience mode of Longhorn is essentially a requirement for most people. At the very least, a PC should be upgradeable to that level (with AGP/PCIe cards, not with PCI).18 - I don't actually recommend the FX 5200 as a card for any of the systems. I mentioned it only as the "fastest" PCI graphics card currently available. The 9550 might also be available in PCI version, in which case it would be something of a toss up, but I haven't heard of any ATI DX9 parts for PCI.
#17 - Of course you can get a cheaper system that what I listed. What you've specced out is pretty much the cheapest "modern" system that could be put together. I personally wouldn't recommend that sort of configuration to a friend (or anyone else) without some serious reservations. Basically, it would be a case of "you can get this if you want, but I will not be held responsible for any shortcomings." You basically hit the point of diminishing returns, where $5 to $10 saved ends up costing you 10% of your overall performance (i.e. going from a Sempron 2400+ to a Sempron 2200+), or else you lose certain features that I consider desirable (DVD+RW support).
It's a personal preference, really, so people can go either way. My feeling is that any *new* system should include at bare minimum the following:
512 MB of RAM
80GB Hard Drive w/8MB cache
Sempron 2400+/Celeron D 320
17" monitor
DVD+RW support
You certainly don't *need* any of those features for standard PC use, but I would definitely recommend spending the extra $50 or so to get them.
PrinceGaz - Monday, January 10, 2005 - link
Excellent article, I couldn't really fault any of the choices, and good explanations were given of why they were selected.One minor point worth mentioning maybe related to Longhorn's graphics requirements, specifically where you say that for the "next version of Windows (codenamed Longhorn), 3D graphics support will actually be required in order to run it properly. Specifically, the word is that Pixel Shader 2.0 support will be required".It will run fine on DX7 hardware in 'Classic' mode (similar to how Windows 2000 looks). Only the 'Aero' and 'Aero Glass' modes require DX9 hardware. Full details on the likely requirements for the three modes can be found here-
http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/device/display/graph...
delldell - Monday, January 10, 2005 - link
Good article; however, the radeon 9550 graphics card is faster than the nvidia FX 5200 while also being cheaper :) At only $60 the 9550 clearly represents the best bang in the the low end video card market. Check out the review from techreport.comhttp://techreport.com/etc/2005q1/bestof2004/index....
ChineseDemocracyGNR - Monday, January 10, 2005 - link
I have a different idea of what a budget computer is.AMD budget:
AMD Sempron 2200+ Retail $54
ASRock K7S41 $49
Corsair Value Select 256MB DDR400 $41
Seagate 40GB 7200RPM 2MB PATA $56
LG 52X32X52 CD-RW Drive $29
same floppy, Case & PSU, Display, Speakers, Keyboard and Mouse as your AMD Budget. $251
Total: $480
AMD Performance Budget:
AMD Sempron 2600+ Retail $86
ASRock K7Upgrade-880 $47
Corsair Value Select 2x256MB DDR400 $68
Gigabyte ATI Radeon 9550 128MB DDR 128-bit $71
Seagate 80 GB 7200 RPM 8MB SATA $69
LG 52X32X52 CD-RW Drive $29
same floppy, Case & PSU, Display, Speakers, Keyboard and Mouse as your AMD Budget. $251
total = $621
Intel Budget:
Intel Celeron D 315 (2.26GHz) Retail $69
ASUS P4S800-MX $60
Corsair Value Select 256MB DDR400 $41
Seagate 40GB 7200RPM 2MB PATA $56
LG 52X32X52 CD-RW Drive $29
same floppy, Case & PSU, Display, Speakers, Keyboard and Mouse as your AMD Budget. $251
Total: $506
Intel Performance Budget:
Intel Celeron D 325J (2.53GHz) Retail $89
ASRock 775V88 $58
Corsair Value Select 2x256MB DDR400 $68
Gigabyte ATI Radeon 9550 128MB DDR 128-bit $71
Seagate 80 GB 7200 RPM 8MB SATA $69
LG 52X32X52 CD-RW Drive $29
same floppy, Case & PSU, Display, Speakers, Keyboard and Mouse as your AMD Budget. $251
total = $635
qquizz - Sunday, January 9, 2005 - link
Just to clarify:Of course ddr400 memory can run at 333 speed. My point is that the memory must be run at 333 to be supported by the motherboard using onboard graphics. This is the case with all NF2 boards with onboard graphics that I've seen.
Jep4444 - Sunday, January 9, 2005 - link
its mainly old Via boards with issues(i mean original K8T800) and for the purpouse of this article an NF3 can be had cheaper than a K8T800pro on 754 so it is a justified move but to say Via chipsets have problems is just not rightWhen it comes to 939 boards, the K8T800Pros(specifically from Abit and Asus) have been the best boards out
erinlegault - Sunday, January 9, 2005 - link
The one thing I think was missing from the graphics section is overclocking options. Overclocking is a great way to gain extra performance from a product. Besides what ATI and others do to turn a Radeon 9600 into a Pro or XT is overclock it and provide adequate cooling and provide faster memory. Why should a user pay a company to overclock a product when they can do it themselves.I personally like Abit's options. They have a line of products based on the Radeon 9550, just an underclocked 9600. But, they have two products, the R9550-Guru and the R9550XTurbo-Guru, which supports their V-Guru overclocking utility. With adequate cooling these products could posibly be overclocked to the 600 MHz of the 9600XT. On the memory, side the Guru has 3.6ns memory that is comparable to the 3.3ns memory of Abit's 9600XT product and probably can't be overclocked much above the stock 400 MHz. But, the interesting part about the XTurbo-Guru is that the memory is 2.5ns and can be easily overclocked. And if you look at the product images, I think adequate cooling is already provided for overclocking.
qquizz - Sunday, January 9, 2005 - link
It should be noted that for the budget motherboard: http://www.msicomputer.com/product/p_spec.asp?mode..."Supports DDR266/333 with internal graphic core, DDR266/333/400 with external add-on card."
In other words, if you wanna use ddr400, it is only supported if you use a discrete video card. If you use the onboard video, only ddr266/333 is supported.
JarredWalton - Sunday, January 9, 2005 - link
Justly - The memory compatibility issues with Nforce3 250 are pretty much confined to the EPoX boards as far as I've heard. All other NF3250 boards will run two DS DIMMs at DDR400. VIA chipsets in general still have some issues. The motherboard is such a critical component that I really don't like to cut any corners, even in the budget sector.In a single review with high-end components (which is how we generally handle reviews), a lot of motherboards work very well. When you start dropping down to cheaper RAM, however, it's amazing how frequently system instabilities seem to end up being caused by the motherboard choice.
Honestly, I dislike writing the budget guide selections, just because there are so many questionable parts. I always try to push customers to spend an extra $30 or so on the motherboard if nothing else. Maybe I'm just superstitious, but I've had several "cheap" systems fail after a year or so due to the motherboard.