Weekly Buyer's Guide: High End System - April 2004
by Evan Lieb on April 30, 2004 12:05 AM EST- Posted in
- Guides
Memory
Recommendation: 2 X 512MB Mushkin PC3500 Level One Dual Pack (CAS2)Price: $239 shipped
While companies like Corsair, OCZ and now Kingston are heavy favorites among high end memory consumers, Mushkin is also starting to gain favor rapidly. In the last few months, we've been using OCZ's Platinum modules as the standard for a majority of AnandTech's testbeds, but we have also been using Mushkin Level One memory (mostly Level II, actually). Unfortunately, it is getting harder and harder to find dual packs nowadays, but Mushkin Level One Dual Packs are available at large vendors like Axion and Newegg, so they're still out there. We've been able to do lots of testing with these specific PC3500 modules and they indeed run stably at PC3500 (433MHz DDR) on many currently available motherboards. There are many PC3500 modules that aren't capable of reliable DDR433 speeds on popular motherboards, so be wary. But motherboards such as the ASUS K8V Deluxe and ABIT IC7-G will run these modules very well, so we suggest that you take a look at them when purchasing your motherboard. However, don't get confused. PC3500 is not an officially sanctioned JEDEC spec, and therefore there are no motherboards on the market which can claim that they officially support PC3500 speeds. PC3500 is quite easily attainable with modern motherboards, but just be aware that PC3200, not PC3500, is the highest speed that your motherboard manufacturer will officially support under warranty.
Alternative: 2 X 512MB OCZ PC3700 GOLD Revision 2 (CAS2.5)
Price: $269 shipped
After developing a reputation based on shoddy business practices, not to mention shoddy memory, OCZ has come roaring back and has gained wide acceptance among enthusiasts and average users alike after many months of wary purchasing and close inspection by hardware web sites like AnandTech. We've raved about OCZ modules in many reviews over the last few months (like this one), and have been extremely pleased with the results that we've been getting. OCZ modules have gone from disappointing and unreliable to impressive and dependable in what seems like an overnight transformation. OCZ still has a ways to go to gain acceptance among doubters who have never tried their memory or continue to hold onto conspiracy theories about their link to the OCZ of old, but we aren't placing OCZ's GOLD Rev. 2 PC3700 modules as an alternative pick based on whim, so take that to heart. The GOLD series is capable of a "low" latency of CAS2.5 (CAS 2.5-3-3-7) at DDR466 speeds (PC3700) and has a huge ceiling for overclockers. If you're not an overclocker, then obviously the GOLD series will not be of much value to you. If you are overclocking, just remember that you take a risk by overclocking your memory, both in terms of voiding warranties and damaging hardware. Beginners need not apply for overclocking.
Video
Recommendation: 128MB PowerColor Radeon 9800 Pro, DVI, TV-outPrice: $206 shipped
Our last high end guide stated that one of our new goals was to bring down the price of our system a bit, as it was getting excessively expensive. Thankfully, we accomplished that goal in our last high end guide and will continue to do so in this guide. Anyway, since it's a well known fact that there is very little difference in performance between the 9800 Pro and 9800XT, we think it's quite reasonable to recommend the 9800 Pro for this high end guide. It's not the fastest video card on the market, something you would expect AnandTech to recommend for a high end guide, but it's darn close and it's over $200 less than the 9800XT. Taking all of this data into account, we simply can't recommend the 9800XT. However, it is a reasonable alternative for a high end system.
If you've kept up to date on your GPU technology recently, you would have caught our review of NVIDIA's GeForce 6800 Ultra, among many other reviews around the net. This is the kind of card that we want to recommend for a high end system. It offers vastly superior performance, image quality, and features compared to the Radeon 9800 Pro and Radeon 9800XT, and is truly a "next generation" product. ATI also has a next generation video card in the works, results of which we will release in the coming days/weeks. But for now, just realize that we are recommending the 9800 Pro simply as an interim solution to NVIDIA and ATI's next generation video cards. If you absolutely cannot wait 2-3 weeks for these next generation NVIDIA/ATI cards to be released, then you will want to purchase that 9800 Pro now. If you can wait, then you are opening yourself up to a significantly better graphics experience.
Alternative: 256MB PowerColor Radeon 9800XT (412MHz), DVI, TV-out
Price: $409 shipped
As we mentioned in previous guides, ATI continues to hold a firm grasp on the add-in desktop video market. While ATI's lead is quite noticeable at the low end and fairly noticeable with the mid-range sector, their lead at the high end isn't quite as drastic. It's still there, as even AnandTech has concluded that the 9800XT is more or less the fastest desktop gaming GPU (Graphics Processing Unit) currently available. Still, NVIDIA's 5950 Ultra trails the 9800XT closely (more on the 5950 in a moment) enough in current games in terms of speed and IQ (image quality), it's pretty clear that the 9800XT is the superior high end product. That's why we recommend it today, with the manufacturer PowerColor, yet again. With this card, you get DVI (if you have an LCD), TV-out, and 256MB of memory. The 256MB of memory will come in really handy with future DX9 titles, though not for quite some time. Overall, you're getting an incredible gaming card here. Just be wary that next generation NVIDIA and ATI cards are literally right around the corner, and that spending $400 on a 9800XT is probably the least sensible thing to do if you can wait a few weeks.
Finally, as we've reiterated several times in other Buyer's Guides, do not purchase 9800SE video cards. They perform on par or, in most cases, slower than a 9600 Pro in 3D games and cost closer to a 9700 Pro. Do not be fooled; a 9800SE performs nothing like a full blown 8 pipe 256 bit memory interface 9800 Pro.
Listed below is part of our RealTime pricing engine, which lists the lowest prices available on ATI video cards from many different reputable vendors:
If you cannot find the lowest prices on the products that we've recommended on this page, it's because we don't list some of them in our RealTime pricing engine. Until we do, we suggest that you do an independent search online at the various vendors' web sites. Just pick and choose where you want to buy your products by looking for a vendor located under the "Vendor" heading.
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Fr0zeN - Friday, April 30, 2004 - link
Yeah I just hooked up raid0 on my IDE's and instead of scoring 41mb/s on Sandra, I score 55mb/s haha... I notice like no difference.Mushkin Level Ones are disappearing fast, and can't be had for that cheap anymore. As for OCZ Revision 2, OCZ has officially discontinued the product for MONTHS, you can still find 256mb sticks but 512mb sticks? In your dreams. If you're in the market for obsolete RAM, might as well auction for pc3500 level 2 mushkins off Ebay while you're at it. Looks like if you want to build this system you're on your own when it comes to RAM.
mino - Friday, April 30, 2004 - link
#10 Exactcly, New raptor is Gorgoeus, take note I DON'T like WD, but this product has no match yet, exactly as 7k400 doesnn't have :)Rekonn - Friday, April 30, 2004 - link
#7, While raid 0 does improve performance, it's doesn't do it by 40% in general. Typical improvement is more like 10%, seehttp://faq.storagereview.com/tiki-index.php?page=S...
If you have extra $$ you're better off getting the raptor than going raid0 with two 7200rpm drives.
mino - Friday, April 30, 2004 - link
Yes, It does have.However:
1) 3400+ should be FX-53, since next year there will be dual-core Opteron !!! Great upgrade option!
2) WD 1200JB is pretty shitty drive(buggy, NOISY, slow), 1x Raptor system + 1xHitachi 7k400 400G for storage
3) MSI Main ?? It is a Joke, I hope ! It's like recommending ECS to server :)
And overal I mean that You should extend 4 guides systems to 5 or 6:
Allways reliability is first but second is:
1.) <$400 Low End -> price
2.) <$800 Mid Range ->price/perf ratio
3.) <$2000 High End ->performance, price/perf (3200+ wil suffice)
4.) <$5000 Enthusiast ->performance (FX-53 is a MUST)
5.) <$600 Low End overclock ->price/perf after overclock
6.) <$1500 High End overclock ->price/perf after overclock
When last 6th guide is only as an option an both 5th and 6th are now well enough represented by Overclock system guide.
You will also get one week + time distance in between guides what proves to me to be pretty neccesary after some full cycles of guides since You usually doesn't have what to change.
Tokat - Friday, April 30, 2004 - link
Whoops! Sorry, i'm new to this forum stuff here! Hey everybody. I just wanted to say that I agree with the stuff about the quicker raptors, and since the recommended motherboard has SATA RAID onboard, why not make it 2xRaptors? That'd be great performance and enough space!... as for somebody talking about 2x1200JB drives in raid mode... does this mobo have IDE RAID??Pjotr - Friday, April 30, 2004 - link
I agree with 6, dual 120 GB S-ATA drives are so cheap today, you get in general 40 % performance increase on the slowest part of your system.nigham - Friday, April 30, 2004 - link
In my experience, getting two harddisks in a RAID array increases performance much more than say, going from a 2.8 GHz to a 3.4 GHz processor, especially for desktop applications. Why not recommend a RAID array for the "high-end" user?GokieKS - Friday, April 30, 2004 - link
I have to second the comment about the case. For a system of this stature, a better case is very much warranted. Heck, I personally think even the Kingwin KT-424 is a better case than the K11 (I hate the acrylic front), and that's about the same price. Beyond that, I think the CoolerMasters and Silverstones are worth the increased cost. Even the SST-TJ03 Nimiz wouldn't be out of place. Sure, $270 more (much more) than what most people would spend on a case, but it's such a well-built case with great features (not that you need the Extended ATX support...) that it's warranted for a high-end system.TrueWisdom - Friday, April 30, 2004 - link
One thing that has always shocked me is the lack of emphasis put on the hard drive, especially in this latest "High End System" guide. The Western Digital Raptor is the single fastest desktop-oriented hard drive on the market: in single-user scenarios, it is neck-and-neck (and often outperforms!) 15K U320 SCSI drives. I've built computers with a spectrum of hard drives, from 5400RPM 2MB to the Raptor itself, and as far as speed goes, it's like comparing a GeforceMX 200 to a Radeon 9800XT: the difference really is that dramatic. Not even the Special Edition WD drives can hold a candle to the Raptor, and in a high-end system, you can't ignore something like that. Furthermore, the noise difference between the 1st gen (36GB) and 2nd gen (74GB) Raptors is very noticeable. While I understand the desire to keep costs down, please realize that you are sacrificing more than "just a little" performance when you pass over the 74GB Raptor. For verification of everything I've said, go to www.storagereview.com. They have in-depth benchmarks of basically every notable hard drive released in the past 5 years, and then you'll see how badly other desktop drives are outclassed by the Raptor.Mackintire - Friday, April 30, 2004 - link
I can not fathom the idea of using a Western Digital 1200JB (120G) anymore. Having experienced Seagate's 7200.7 FDB serial ATA (120G) hard drive it is plain and simply no contest. The Seagate drive is faster, quieter, more reliable, runs cooler, and has a higher sustained transfer rate.I build near 30 computers a month, and since I have switched to Seagate's hard drives with FDB I have not had a single return due to bearing noise. I had a 3 out of 10 western digital drive bearing failure rate.
Mackintire